Get A Grip - FIT & Proper:

I wonder how the numbers of 'FIT and PROPER' Licensed Firearms users are holding up? - I'd put money on the current 50 page Firearms Licence Application forms and the highly obstructive process having cut the numbers to around 50% of earlier days.

- The 'application form' to apply to join the NZ Police is ONE PAGE.

WHY are NZ's Civilian Police exempted from meeting the same Firearms Licence requirements as citizens to carry their MSSAs and semi-auto Pistols?

__________________

 SAFETY TIP, you won't ever get a chain-fire if you only shoot single shot pistols eh.

You might say that the study of 'Pocket Pistols' is an obscure topic - in that there is no lying douchebag fraudulent gun broker RL Wilson that spent 30 years writing books making-up false heritage and valuations about early Colts revolvers while stealing the best items from museum collections. - Nobody has ever bothered to falsify and record much history about low cost single shot percussion pistols from the 18th and 19th Centuries.

Provenance? - Both of these boxlock Percussion Pistols are English Proof Stamped

from mid 19th Century- The Carry Guns of their time.

Gawd but I've read some crap about GRIPS .. one online bloke said he couldn't see any difference between Glock grips and '1911' grips. Gotta be a 'dumbfuck' that one.

The Glock G19X fits MY hands best with the thickest BackStrap.

Another 'merican writes that he couldn't see why auto pistol grips were different shaped to S/A Revolvers .. well derr - you don't shove a magazine - sorry, a "clip" - up the arse of a Peacemaker.

Moi - I'd observe that all those early old "flintlock" pistols, - having that slow BLACKPOWDER push recoil give you a chance to hold a secure grip .. nothing like the sharp snap from a modern nitro powered pistol.

The Variables: Can I also say this - If you have 'average' hands then lucky you, - the average gun grip will likely be fine. If you've got tiny little hands then you do have an issue - as all but the smallest guns are going to be too bloody big. And I don't mean, go buy an airweight alloy snubby 357 Magnum. 

- And if you've got longer finger bones - you likely will need bigger grips that push the bulk of the gun forward and bring the trigger near to where your trigger finger bends nicely.

There is no way you will be able to shoot a handgun both accurate and fast unless that gun fits your hands. - You might love the looks of a 'Desert Eagle' but if you can't hang-on to it under blast-off you should forget it.

__________

Not all so called "flintlocks" are flintlocks - many are percussion Caplocks.

Many single shot antique guns you will find in New Zealand will be the el cheapo BOXLOCK pattern that experts describe as being of a common, low cost type, of indifferent quality. - As found and offered for sale these are often badly rust corroded and pitted - and, and if of the 'turn-off barrel' type they likely will be seized solid and covered in gouges from vise grip attempts made to unseize them. The inside of the barrel and powder chamber typically are corroded and filthy while the nipples are also likely to be damaged by repeated dry firing .. provided that the mainspring is not broken - which many are.

What are these antiques properly called ?

Boot Pistol, Muff Pistol, Pocket Pistol, Sleeve Gun, Vest Pocket Pistol, "Derringer" are names I've seen used for these carry guns of yesteryear.

These 'BOXLOCK Turn-off' Pistols .. may even sometimes mistakenly be called "a Queen Anne pistol" - when a genuine 'Queen Anne' would be a sidelock FLINTLOCK.

There are no legal definitions of what these antiques are properly called - nor are there standards that describe the patterns of their handles .. GRIPS or Stocks: 

Cane Handle, Bag Shaped, Slab Sided, Saw-Handle, Birds' Head, Plow Handle, 'Stirrup-type butt-cap with long side-terminals'. - Back then they might be whatever shape the maker fancied.

Here's a Link to an excellent black powder Elmer Keith article (Chapter 6 from 'SIXGUNS'):

https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/keith-article-on-cap-and-ball-pistols-long.11474/

FIT & PROPER ?

FIREARMS LICENCES FOR POLICE.

Marty K.

Explosive (Verbal) Diarrhea

 That's an awful word to spell correctly .. diarrhea 

- Try 'TRIAMINOTRINITROBENZENE'

or even better, - how about 'HEXANITROHEXAAZAISOWURZITANE' .. but, for convenience - the lads at China Lake call this one CL-20.

RED and GREEN go SO well together, don't you find?

John Lennon is reputed to have written "Life is what happens while you're planning something else"

I'm all in favour of sensible grown adult shooters mixing three basic ingredients together to make small amounts of antique propellant 'Black Powder' to use carefully and safely in muzzle loading guns - but ..

Pissing about with explosives is not a good idea .. hexamethylene triperoxide diamine HMTD for short - is an unstable primary explosive that is popular with suicide bombers because it is fairly easy to make - but it tends to blow unexpectedly .. which naturally may be of some little consequence, as once these persons have decided to end it all by suicide, the timing should not be all that important eh

Anyone who feels they need to develop and make explosives should study so well as to qualify for University and get their 'Masters' in Organic Chemistry before trying to cook-up a storm in a properly designed facility, while wearing PPE..

Now, as I've never had an original thought in my life, I will adjust Lennon's lyrics to read "DEATH is what happens when you may be planning something else"

CHINA LAKE - About 1.1 MILLION Acres:

It seems to sort of SURROUND Los ANGELES

China Lake is a Naval Air Base located in California's Mojave Desert - where they develop and test explosive warheads as efficient Weapons of Mass Destruction - to bring freedom, democracy, and the American Way of Life to mostly brown and black skinned people who have resources such as oil and minerals.

RNZ National are reporting that NZDF are taking part in drone development and testing in the Mojave Desert - to maintain our position with current military technology. That's nice eh.

China Lake is roughly equidistant between Los Angeles and Las Vegas as the crow flies, which it can’t, because the air space is restricted. - It gets hot there, and there are lots of Native American petroglyphs that you can make an appointment to visit - IF you are an American citizen. - there are no longer lots of Native Americans there. They blow up lots of shit there .. but they do try to do it ecologically & quietly.

Missiles, Bombs, Drones, & Loitering munitions, are meant to explode - but this next image is EARTHQUAKE DAMAGE on that Navy Base.

China Lake is a U S Navy Air Base - so there might possibly be a U S Air Force Harbour and Shipyard, - a U S Army Mission & Cathedral in The Vatican, and a U S Coastguard Space Port on the dark side of the Moon. - With some 800 U S military bases they could be anywhere (complete with explosives).

Now it's nothing to me - But if you are interested, THIS wee BOOK is very interesting and, at appropriate times, amusing:

BOOM The Chemistry and History of Explosives by Simon Quellin Field

from CHICAGO REVIEW PRESS

Life is good,

Marty K.

Firearms from Early New Zealand:

 The arrival of pakeha industrial era technology .. edged weapons and guns, did not cause or start tribal warfare in New Zealand. The warriors had long crafted weapons from bone, stone and wood, training with them from boyhood, to become fearful combatives. 

- The Paintbrush does not create the Masterpiece .. and guns do not cause violence.

 - Certainly Maori soon learned to use 'western technology' - persuading the captains of sailing ships to carry war parties on coastal raids and seeking muskets and cannon of their own as soon as they could barter services & sell stuff to greedy sailors.

"You want dried tattooed heads captain - sure. - You like my sister huh?"  

The 'Musket Wars' from around 1818-1845 have also been called "potato wars" - as the locals were quick to adopt the latest economic trends to attack and dominate their neighbours .. enslaving survivors to work new fields, growing potato crops to trade for muskets and powder,  using those muskets to attack the neighbours, and do it all again,  enlarging the circle into a Growth Industry.

The nine separate signed copies of the 1840 Treaty of Waitangi didn't do anything much to stop the warfare.

Early New Zealand Entrepreneur

Flintlock Musket by Ketland .."taken in Kawittis Pa, Ruapekapeka 1846"

Presented to Hongi Hika by King George IV in 1820

 - a Flintlock Musket converted later to Percussion.

Maori Wars, Musket Wars, Land Wars .. Maori were warriors and fought intertribally long before the whalers and sealers turned-up - then the incoming white settlers were land hungry - and traded, scammed, or just stole by force the best land they could find. - Both sides of this inevitable conflict naturally used the most effective weaponry they could obtain.

Some folk will call any old gun a "Flintlock"

I want to bring COCK into the conversation ..

RING Neck or Double Throated Cock

SWAN or GOOSE Neck Cock

The elegant swanneck flint cocks sometimes broke and rendered the gun USELESS - so it might well be restored by fitting a stronger 'ringneck' cock - only later to once again, be upgraded by conversion to Percussion lock and a hammer. - Money was tight - so make do and mend was the way.

In 1852, 500 flintlock muskets were shipped back to England for replacement with 500 Percussion models.

In time, Maori grew to favor the Double Barreled shotgun TUPARA and the hatchet as personal weapons

- Around 1860's Breech loading Carbines updated the NZ Forces equipment ..

Calisher & Terry Carbine

And Adams revolvers began to be imported and issued:

Here's a great site for historic smallarms record ..

https://rnzaoc.com/tag/new-zealand-wars/

Original Antique Colts are around New Zealand.

I'm definately no "expert" on any of this - but I'd reckon many of the antiques I currently have were brought into New Zealand by gold miners and 'adventurers' from California and Australia looking to join the Gold Rushes in the 1850's and 60's. - There are still to this day,  large gold mines in operation at Waihi on the Coromandel Peninsula and Macraes Flat in Otago.

I truly understand that the exemplary pre-European Maori were corrupted and victimised by white Colonialism.

Back then - Capitalism and Christianity were well practiced in the arts of civilizing and exploiting the 'poorly educated' of the day.

Marty K.

I Don't Like Being Lied To ..

 I Don't Like Being Lied to .. especially by governments

"All we want is the facts ma'am." - Famous words from 'Joe Friday' as a LAPD detective, who carried a S&W Model 10 snub-nosed 38 revolver in the 'DRAGNET' TV series. 

I gave up watching "free-to-air" TV about 15 years ago .. because I don't like having my head messed with by advertising and 'spin'. 

- I do still own a TV - but have not turned it on in all those years except to see recorded movies & top-line series, such as Game of Thrones and Breaking Bad.

Repeat: I don't like being lied to ..

"FREE TO AIR T.V" is NOT free. - All that damn advertising costs us heaps every damn time it interrupts the content, every damn 10 minutes and WE pay for it every damn time we buy anything at the supermarket where the product is priced to add the manufacturers marketing costs, the advertising agency's profits, the retail outlet's mark-ups, and all the other corporate add-ons.

That constant repetition of the same adverts - over'n'over - is hammering their message into our brains in a psychologicaly planned technique called conditioning or 'Brain-Washing'.

The so called 'News' episodes are mostly opinion breaks (propaganda) - chatty discussion breaks - between the advertising breaks. Now even their "frontline footage" can be shaped and AI generated in a studio, to insert the narrative, and increase profits. - I don't like being lied to ..

Fact: Since Capital Punishment was ceased - the Murder Rate has increased and is many times greater than before. - Exactly how much greater is hard to assess as definitions of murder have been changed and statistics 'adjusted'.

Fact: We are told NOT to hold law abiding Muslims as being in any way responsible for the terrorist acts of a few fanatics - While ALL of we legally licensed gun owners are punished and restricted for the actions of a few violent nutters and killers.

Fact: There are 350 Million people in 'democratic' USA - yet ONE (weird) man -  narrowly elected as President can completely reverse and change policies by presidential decree.

Fact: "Alternative Facts" are not facts - They are lies.

Fact: This is not 'my opinion' .. This is FACT.

I am a pacifist. 

I am a lifelong gun owner and law abiding hunter & shooter.

The British Government taught me how to shoot as a 14 year old in 1958, on the school range, in the Combined Cadet Force.

I am totally opposed to the mass killings of Government warfare and their Weapons of Mass Destruction.

I fully support Capital Punishment - The Death Penalty - for all proven murderers and war criminals. - Evil Killers should be erased from society.

Marty K.

Pity The Forcing Cones on Revolvers:

This is a critical area ..

 

VARIABLES again

Hands up all of those who noted the shim-shield fitted in A attempting to protect the top strap from flame-cutting erosion .. 

Forcing Cones are cut at 11 degrees ? 

(Half of 90 is 45,  half of 45 is 22.5 - half of that is 11.25?)

.. what about Free Bores?

and the dreaded Cylinder Gap ..

Who was Deep Throat? *

There may have been a weakness in the metal here ..

They can Break:

This high pressure zone is exposed to ABUSE, abrasion, heat, flame, and Gas Pressure .. Add to that, wear & tear combined with NEGLECT - CORROSION - Metalurgical faults - AND poor dimensioal control resulting from dull cutters, worn jigs, unskilled machinists, and cavalier Quality Control.

Top bullet Fired from cylinder with NO barrel

Distorted by gas pressure instead of 'obturated' to the bore

- And that is just the FORCING CONE .. What about the rest of that horrific design, claimed by Samuel Colt to be his original genius?

Revolvers are an awful clockwork mechanical device involving levers and cams - gears and springs sliding and pivoting in conflicting directions or VECTORS with the function of REPEATABILITY - that, if all goes well, will permit a heat engine to sequentially accelerate small but massive projectiles towards and into a target - when activated by the muscles of one finger.

There are gas leaks, friction losses, pressure losses, conra-rotations, misalignments, and moments of recoil with injurious loud noise conspiring to thwart any achievement while the human element tries to focus at three distinct ranges to align three points ..

What about that swing-out CRANE or even better, the TOP-BREAK unloading device? - Mechanical nightmares.

Naturally there are "experts" who claim that revolvers are superior weapons because of their mechanical simplicity ..

DON'T YOU JUST LOVE REVOLVERS?

c&rsenal Revolver 101: link

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IR66UUlqsIo&t=3006s

Marty K.

* DEEP THROAT was William Mark Felt Snr - FBI Special Agent and Deputy Director who revealed WATERGATE secrets to the public via The Washington Post .. leading to President Nixon's 1974 resignation.

Don't Talk Rubbish ..

I'm used to old crap - as my first sportscar in 1966 London was a red 1956 Austin Healey 100/6 BN4 that had both front wings rusted-out & flapping at speed and it burned almost as much oil as petrol, with the passenger side door held closed by twisted wire. - I could see backwards through the cracks in the rear vinyl opening - handy for spotting Metropolitan Police patrol cars. - With the rear seat pan lifted you could twist 'round and whack the fuel pump with a spanner to jerk it back to life - and the engine heat rising through the passenger footwell encouraged the ladies to lift and show a lot of leg. - The best 100 quid I ever spent on rubbish.

Mummie - Are Boot Pistols a Limp Excuse?

Not much new here then .. just more rubbish talk about rubbish.

The images come from my rubbish smartphone.

Most of the antique percussion Pocket Pistols I own are double rubbish - because as a class of collectibles they are held in low esteem, having been made cheaply, to sell cheaply, in the mid 19th Century - and when I get them - they are damaged, old, rusty, and at best with faults.

I read that, back in the day, gun makers might throw-in a pocket pistol with a pair of gentlemens side-by-side game getters, as incentive for fast payment of the account.

- Would that make these bird scarers of no account ?

90% of my NZ "Boot/Muff/Pocket pistols" are turn-off barreled, breech loading, smooth bores, in .450 inch caliber - Which is around a 50 Bore (meaning x 50 balls, sized .44" (- allowing for the patch fabric), can be cast from one pound of Lead) in Olde English - But this wee mouse in the Pics is an even cheaper fixed barrel, muzzle loader.

Yup .45" caliber firearms are 50 Bore guns.

While these pocket pistols are not as crappy as "Saturday Night Specials" - they are nearly what Americans would recognise as THROWDOWN GUNS that a cop would carry, to place on the body of someone he shot, to justify the killing ..

In their time - cheap functional tools for everyday carry.

Their drilled bores mostly now are corroded with pitting .. but they seem to have been sold as rough drilled smooth-bores anyway.

But strange to tell - this old thing is remarkably unrotted and would be safe to use with ball and powder.

It may be only little fired because the mainspring was able to pivot to one side and disengage from the hammer notches - which is why, when I bought it - it was fucked (that's a Technical Term) as well as dirty & rusty. - But the nipple too also appears undamaged and un-corroded.

You are seeing this piece of crap after I have fixed it, cleaned it and de-rusted it, AND after I have further ruined it by draw filing the octagonal barrel flats before smoothing the finish with 2000 grade wet'n'dry carborundum grit abrasive *.

That barrel surface, as bought, did have heavy pitting and active rust having been gouged by some moron using a Bastard File or farrier's hoof rasp. - So, who actually rubbished it?

Many old 19th century percussion guns got handed-down to stupid BOYS to play with outside in the yard when cartridge guns replaced them .. so we get what we pay for now in the 21st eh.

* More Rubbish .. Who knew that carborundum grit wet/dry abrasive paper - that I've used for ever - was actually SILICON CARBIDE - that has so many wonderful uses in this world .. including as a "synthetic diamond" MOISSANITE in jewelry?

It seems that this rare mineral is a common sort of STARDUST out there in space .. WOW

Google it here ..  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silicon_carbide

S'amazing,

Marty K.

- Talking about STARS - how many do you reckon are there in our Galaxy The Milky Way ?

Answer: Between 100 - 400 BILLION STARS in The Milky Way - and at least that many planets ..

So .. How many GALAXIES do you reckon there might be in the UNIVERSE?

Try 2 TRILLION ?

M.

Stainless .. Just SKidding

I LIKE stainless steel revolvers ..

"They" settled on the name 'Stainless Steel' as it is generally a useful description for steels that resist staining and rusting ..BUT SS is not rustproof or stainless. - I could show you the bore of a Ruger Old Army percussion revolver that had pitting throughout it's length - it still shot great.

Stainless but Streaky YUCK - (not mine)

You gotta laugh eh ..

If a magnet sticks to it - it ain't Stainless Steel - WRONG. - There are five distinct families of SS and some of them are non-magnetic while others are magnetic .. some even can change when heated. - and some are mixed.

Way back in 1798 experimenters started working at adding chromium to iron & steel - but generally it is stated that stainless steel was invented in 1913 at the same British firm (Firths) who had been delivering "silver, spring" steels to Samuel Colt for some 20 years in the mid 1800s.

Some early stainless steel guns suffered from GALLING or cold welding of sliding surfaces - but modern lubricants and mixing the metal types has long fixed that issue.

I like shiny things ..

I even like polishing stuff like copper, brass and steel - and I hate RUSTY tools

'Patina' is prized and said to be rust and damage that indicates authenticity. Hmm. - I'd say it indicates NEGLECT.

- Moi, I'd prefer my classics & antiques 'as new' & in full working condition if I could get it.

Stainless Steel helps to maintain firearms and edged tools in a good state. Why would anyone want a grotty stained old high carbon steel knife blade to cut their steak?

- If you need to learn all about Austenitic, Ferritic, and Martensitic steels - you can look it up yourself eh,

Marty K.

 

Old Guns - New Money ..

 The Remington New Model Army "1858" 6 shot Percussion 44 Revolver was made from around 1863 to 1875 and was offered for sale to the Union Army for a reasonable $15 each. 

My nice example, bought some six months ago here in New Zealand - may have been from a batch sold-off as surplus from PENSACOLA Navy Base, Florida, in 1873, for $2.50 each.

I remember grimacing in pain while transfering the "buy now" price to the private museum selling this antique .. but I justified that cost knowing that these original revolvers are far from common here in New Zealand as OFF REGISTER antiques .. not capable of firing metallic cartridges.

 - $4,500

As I write this - there is another one on trademe offered with a 'Buy Now' price of  $7,250

I guess that this exemplifies the dreaded inflation - explained as being either that 'stuff' keeps on costing more .. or, any money you keep under your mattress loses worth every time you get into bed - until you just give it all to the grandkids ..

One way to beat inflation might be to buy quality items that you enjoy .. such as classic cars - Ferraris, Manx Norton motorcycles, or fake oil-on-canvas paintings

or, if your investment income consists of Superannuation from WINZ .. try rusty old pop-pops from the past. Such item might just prove useful at Armageddon.

I'm not claiming my Remington revolver is the same, better (or poorer) than the one on offer .. but it is of similar value as a collectable - and the asking price does appear to be rising sharply. Naturally, nothing says the vendor will actually GET his asking price either ..

When I ditched my lovely, - fully licensed and Registered, as new, Ruger SP101 in 327 Federal Magnum - it sold at a heavy loss at around one quarter of what it cost to import and register with NZ Police.

The bottom fell-out of the LICENSED FIREARMS MARKET in New Zealand - as the direct result of prohibitive punitive rushed law changes following the Christchurch Mosque Massacre.

I auctioned that fine accurate, four inch 32 caliber revolver - the last of my 'restricted weapons' - because my rising years and falling eyesight made me decide to let my Firearms Licence lapse.

Marty K.

There you go - Life IS Good

Just because something is old does NOT mean that it is useless ..

- Interested in the POWER obtained from old matchlock/tinderlock 16th Century 'Arquebuses' ? - Well watch this and be surprised ..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uC2mGsiSFZ4

M.

Something New - Kel-Tec PR57 Pistol:

 I've been looking at SHOT SHOW 2025 reports for any news of innovative developments in small arms for the future ..  ..

Well that was a waste of time eh.

- Except there is one interesting, high capacity, .22 small caliber STRIPPER feed semi-auto pistol from Kel-Tec chambered in 5.7x28mm. - TWENTY ROUNDS CAPACITY.

Restricted Magazine Capacity? - try NO Magazine For Size ..

Maybe that's not the point - as the PR57 is a very slim .94 inch and lightweight carry gun. That's under an inch wide versus a Glock 19 at over an inch and a quarter - that could prove popular in USA .. but that cartridge - which is now a NATO approved Personal Defence Weapon PDW standard round, - designed to replace the 9x19 pistol caliber, is also interesting.

Bottle Necked cartridges are said to FEED more reliably ..

The 5.7x28mm is around a THIRD smaller and lighter than the 9mm NATO cartridge which is a factor in military considerations. - Military Generals want their operatives to be able to carry as many rounds as possible to achieve MAXIMUM KILL RATE (MKR) under all circumstances.

- This 'Two-Two' center fire round pushes it's bullets well above 2,000 ft per sec .. say from 2,300 to 2,800 feet per second with less recoil, - which is nice - but with horrific LOUD REPORT & MUZZLE FLASH.

- Should be great for Hearing Aid sales and incapacity benefits .. You'd have to be a loony to shoot one of these things without an auto-darkening welding screen and both earplugs AND ear defenders clamped on your skull.

A very nasty little cartridge for nasty applications .. that apparantly is being increasingly adopted by U S Police Departments.

The projectiles TUMBLE in soft tissue while rapidly dumping energy - thus helping solve over penetration issues in crowded 'hoods.

Is this the future?

- Or some enterprising maker needs to introduce a more pistol friendly 5.7x28mm cartridge with less powder wasting blast and maybe heavier, blunter pills ..

Marty K.

Greased Leather, Woodie Grips:

I got this tan leather 'Doc Holiday' holster rig made for my antique '1858' Remington New Model Army .44 built 1863. 

- Holster made & listed by standingbull on trademe. - Now I'm not showing you this to skite about it but to suggest that you jokers consider the value of LANOLIN natural sheep's wool grease ..

This Leather has been 'Dressed' twice with Lanolin

Now I got this new leather wrap to protect and store the original old sixgun from dings & dust .. so I wanted to "dress" the leather inside & out with some kind of anti-corrosive lube - as I have heard about the acids used to 'tan' raw leather causing the dreaded RUST to guns left laying around in holsters.

I wanted to use natural product, - LANOLIN is the grease washed-out of raw sheep's wool after harvesting, and you don't see any rusty sheep around - even on New Zealand's wild and wet 'West Coast' eh. - I understand I could try a silicone product or whatever .. No guarantee that what I'm doing will bring everlasting peace & happiness into your world - but I'm trying.

LANOLIN is 97% long chain waxy esters

Lanolin is sold as a cosmetic skin care product AND IT WORKS. - I have it for my old hands and I blended some into my black powder lube made from Bee's Wax & Rape Seed Oil.

The pot of grease was by my chair when I attacked the scratched varnish & dings on the grip of this affordable antique Pocket Pistol with 0000 steel wool wetted with methylated spirits (alcohol) .. so after giving the woodie a good rub and a rest to recover I polished it with the lanolin and it came up well.

It looks great doesn't it? - much improved, but be aware this is an animal product.

I like the stuff and it's 'local' - But you may not like using it or might even be allergic .. who knows?

Life is good 

Marty K.

Eccentric Grubby Old Boxes:

 .. That's called "Click Bait" eh

If you take a gander (which means "to stretch one's neck to see, like a male goose") at these three BOX LOCK Percussion Pocket Pistols you will observe some differences ..

A weird thing - that gun in the middle is likely the most poorly made antique pistol that I have, 

BUT it's my current favourite, because it realy fits comfortably into my hand & trigger reach

- That's an empty propellant tin

- All three of these cheap antiques have octagonal barrels

- the first from the left has it's HAMMER centralised in the action

- the second - middle - percussion pistol has it's HAMMER offset towards the right (eccentric)

- the third box-lock has it's HAMMER placed so far to the right as to be outside of the boxlock and is a 'SIDELOCK' gun. (- And it has a hidden trigger that drops when cocked).

Now I've no idea what the mid 19th century makers had on their minds when they chose their specialty pattern to make .. probably "This is going to make me rich" - but experts write that it's all about facilitating sighting - which I seriously doubt, as these everyday carry pocket pistols were close range repellents .. "GET OFF ME" guns, not target pistols. - Just marketing? but interesting.

Now, - these mid 19th century Pocket Pistols or Muff Pistols are - sort of - the European version of American Derringers (these 3 percussion guns pictured are English Birmingham proofed, unknown, & Belgian, Leige stamped) and are sensibly 'smooth bored' - But, you Jokers naturally will know that all genuine Deringers have 'back-lock' actions and rifled barrels.

Why would anyone increase the friction losses by cutting rifling into a short range handgun?

As far as I can gather - the first 'BOX LOCK' pistol appeared around 1730 - being a flintlock - and the first turn-off barrels on pistols date back to 1640ish.

The very FIRST hand cannon 火铳 known is Chinese and dated to 1288. (They got to Europe by 1364).

Henry Deringer claimed to have made his first 'Deringer type pistol' in 1825 .. so it was quite an old design that became popular there for killing presidents.

____________

Now - the second bent feature of box-locks - that has taken me years to notice - is that these 'boxes' containing the actions are NOT square and parallel sided - but they are tapered from back to front.

Yes I am slow witted .. but I never gave it a thought .. moi just being assumptive I guess

These boxes get tighter the further you go up ..

they are not as "low budget" as I thought

I've owned that Mitutoyu vernier caliper for nearly 65 years and can still read it - I wonder how many of the new digital versions might work in 65 years time?

Putting it simply - these pistols are basic & very useful tools. Modern thinking versus the olden times .. Back then these pistols were everyday carry by respectable adults - whereas now we BAN GUNS rather than raise disciplined trustworthy and responsible citizens and permanently removing dangerous deviant scum from society.

- Talking about deviant scum .. If you ever wonder about Democracy and who rules the world - Consider that Elon Musk being 'worth' some 421 Billion Dollars - bought the American government - for just TWO DAYS of his income and every other Western nation's venal leadership would likely cost even less.

Even so, Life is good,

Marty K.

New Old Shooting Stuff:

Will FB remove my content yet again? - We will see.

I've been 'at it' again - buying antique Black Powder gear .. "Old Junk" as my ex would say

The double sided in-line capper, - tin of ELEY percussion caps, and the powder measure are part of one lot of stuff - while the pistol size Powder Flask was separate, as was the muzzle loading Pocket Pistol ..

All You Need Now Is an 'original' Box, eh Mate ..

I had to make a new stopper for the brass Powder Flask from a piece of pine dowel rod - as the cap was just flopping loose, - while the vendors description of two rusty percussion pistols said "in need of attention as non functional with seized triggers" - I got lucky with this one as - after drilling out the frozen top grip screw to remove the stock - I spotted that the main spring had slipped to the right and it now works positively like a bought 'un after levering the spring back to its central operating location.

This anonymous  "Muff" Pistol has no makers mark nor Proof stamps .. but has the number 46 stamped on the hammer, trigger guard, trigger, & box lock action. Interestingly this everyday old lump has a fixed barrel rather than a 'turn-off' - but the hammer is offset to the right for sighting by steadily squinting along the barrel maybe.

Yes I understand that I have RUINED any collector value by scraping-off all the rust, patina & filing gouges and by re-finishing it to some degree when restoring it's function .. but it was stuffed useless corroded scrap when bought and I prefer owning a decent WORKING antique. - The kids can throw it all away after the cremation party eh 😀

I'm not that concerned about the $$ value of these collectors items as most of the fun is in the fixing but I reckon these antique off licence pistols and percussion revolvers have risen in asking price by around 50% every year in the last few here in New Zealand - whereas used Registered firearms seem to have halved or worse in value, as licensed shooters drop-out and sell-off everything they treasured at a loss. - Makes them more affordable for the stickered recreational chemists I suppose ..

Life is Good eh,

Marty K.